Let me say that I am agnostic. I think an atheist says, “There is no God, god or gods.” while I say, “I don’t know.”
Maybe there is a God or god or gods, who knows? I will say that, in my opinion, maybe.
But then we get to which God, god or gods? As Heinlein said, all of them have to go in the hat. Sorry if that pisses you off, but that’s the way I see it.
Maybe Zeus is pissed off we’re not sacrificing white bulls to him or Huitzilipochti is pissed off we’re not sacrificing people, Baal has to be partly happy with our abortion rate (especially partial-birth abortion), but we’re not exactly sacrificing babies to him so his happiness is qualified.
Personally, I’m rooting for a Jonathan Livingston Seagull sort of deal of going up, sideways or down the ladder.
A quote from the Federalist link
My point is not just that it is possible to offer a secular defense of free markets and liberty and the moral values that support them. My point that is these arguments have a power to persuade that cannot be matched just by quoting chapter and verse from the Bible.
I’ve been Troll for a Day a number of times because I try to explain that I can be in favor of civilization without believing in God.
Take something simple like traffic.
A lane ends on the highway, so what happens? If you’re in any metropolitan region, most people line up but a bunch of assholes have to be first so they screw the whole thing up.
If everybody worked together we’d all go through more quickly, the people being assholes screw it up for not just the polite people but for all the assholes behind them as they force traffic down to a crawl.
Civilization is a compilation of like situations, if we all work together, in a Christian manner, then life is better for all of us.
You do not need to believe in God to realize that or to believe that Jesus was probably the very best, most wise western philosopher ever (Bush should not have taken shit over that, he was right in my opinion), certainly the one whose philosophy has led to the best outcome for the most people.
Besides, many of the worst, non-commie, things we’ve done to each other is in service to a religion. There are few, non-commie, things more scary than a despot who thinks he’s doing God’s will. I will also say that communism/socialism/nannarchism is a religion without a god. Today’s leftism is a religion with a god, Gaia, and we’ve pissed her off by being imprius so…global worming.
My point, if we stop fucking with each other, life is better for everybody. It’s that simple.
You do not need a religion to believe that, as Ace says, you merely need to look at empirical evidence, logic and results.
It should be noted, of course, that religious people do not rely exclusively on religious precepts to make their cases. They, too, point to observable evidence and make secular (math-based, policy outcome based) arguments.
Preach it brother.